Little problem with my new EBD

When the inline 4 drop target bank reset, drop target #2 drop ( in the 7 drop target bank). The two coil are supposed to share a transistor or they are related???

I try to swap the expander solenoid board, same result. try to swap the big solenoid board, still the same.

ask for some photo to see if there is a mistake in the wiring around the expander solenoid board ( Mr niceguy did a playfield swap), and found nothing.

Mr niceguy had a problem with the expander solenoid board that we discuss here:

http://archive.maaca.org/s107351202.onlinehome.us/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1257378510/

Maybe it's related.

any help will be appraciated, I'm not so good with the schematic but I have it.

thank you...

Almost ready to have someone to look at it, so if someone are willing to come and look at it, no problem.

Salut, je te sugere de lire ceci:
http://www.pinrepair.com/bally/index3.htm#expand
(Marvin a résolue 95% de mes problèmes de pin et on y appris une tonnes de chose)
Tu risque fort de pouvoir trouver le bobo grace a marvin en suivant ses indications.
Aussi une petite chose a faire avant qui est simple est de resetter le bookeeping a zero ( no. 5-16 du seft test switch du coin door) et no. 16-22 a 3. Si il y a des chiffres bizarres d'inscrit ca peut faire des drole chose sur le playfield.  

Aussi as-tu changer le lamp driver pour voir si le prob viens de la car l'expander board utilise un transistor du lamp driver pour fonctionner.

Is this occuring during both gameplay and solenoid test mode ?

Is the drop target #2 drop coil actually firing during the reset of the
inline 4 drop target bank reset ? (e.g. is the issue electrical, or mechanical,
where wear or a missing spring could make the drop target fall with any
slight vibration on the playfield, caused by the other target bank reset)?

After confirming the above, HAL-9000's suggestion above should help.
If not, I personally would try to swap the two PIA chips on the MPU (U10, U11),
with the power off, of course.

I understand that Mr Niceguy had a wiring issue earlier, as opposed to boards issue.
He had that fixed under the playfield I think, but I do not know if there were any
remaining issues afterwards.

Last check: with the schematics, verify all wires going to the solenoid expander board,
to ensure proper connections at the right places.


Bonne chance!
- Sylvain.

I had a very similar solenoid problem on an EBD where two coils were firing when only one should have been. I searched and searched for the solution. I suspected the expander board, the wiring, the driver board, the MPU... everything.

I eventually solved the problem...

All coils controlled by the Solenoid Expander Board must be of the 3-lug, 2-diode variety. If any of those coils have two lugs and one diode, all kids of stupid coil problems will result and you'll be chasing your tail until you replace the coil with the correct type.

Troubleshooting this problem can be difficult if a previous repair was done using parts that look correct but aren't.

Quoted from HAL-9OOO

Salut, je te sugere de lire ceci:
http://www.pinrepair.com/bally/index3.htm#expand
(Marvin a résolue 95% de mes problèmes de pin et on y appris une tonnes de chose)
Tu risque fort de pouvoir trouver le bobo grace a marvin en suivant ses indications.
Aussi une petite chose a faire avant qui est simple est de resetter le bookeeping a zero ( no. 5-16 du seft test switch du coin door) et no. 16-22 a 3. Si il y a des chiffres bizarres d'inscrit ca peut faire des drole chose sur le playfield.  

Aussi as-tu changer le lamp driver pour voir si le prob viens de la car l'expander board utilise un transistor du lamp driver pour fonctionner.

Merci Maxime pour la reponse.

je resetter le bookeeping et rien n,a changer, je n'ai pas encore essayer de switcher le lamp driver board, mais j'essairai en fin de semaine, Merci

Quoted from sylvain

Is this occuring during both gameplay and solenoid test mode ?

Is the drop target #2 drop coil actually firing during the reset of the
inline 4 drop target bank reset ? (e.g. is the issue electrical, or mechanical,
where wear or a missing spring could make the drop target fall with any
slight vibration on the playfield, caused by the other target bank reset)?

After confirming the above, HAL-9000's suggestion above should help.
If not, I personally would try to swap the two PIA chips on the MPU (U10, U11),
with the power off, of course.

I understand that Mr Niceguy had a wiring issue earlier, as opposed to boards issue.
He had that fixed under the playfield I think, but I do not know if there were any
remaining issues afterwards.

Last check: with the schematics, verify all wires going to the solenoid expander board,
to ensure proper connections at the right places.


Bonne chance!
- Sylvain.

Thank's Sylvain, It's not mechanical because both coils fire at the same time in test mode. this is the first thing I check (spring) when i noticed the problem. I have also noticed in test mode, #1 drop target drop when the outhole kicker is activated, but it's ok when I play, that's happens only in test mode.

I will try the swap chip this week end.

thank's for your help

Gino

Quoted from cooke

I had a very similar solenoid problem on an EBD where two coils were firing when only one should have been. I searched and searched for the solution. I suspected the expander board, the wiring, the driver board, the MPU... everything.

I eventually solved the problem...

All coils controlled by the Solenoid Expander Board must be of the 3-lug, 2-diode variety. If any of those coils have two lugs and one diode, all kids of stupid coil problems will result and you'll be chasing your tail until you replace the coil with the correct type.

Troubleshooting this problem can be difficult if a previous repair was done using parts that look correct but aren't.

#1 and #2 drop target drop coils, outhole kicker, saucer, reset 4 bank target and 7 bank reset drop target are 3-lug coils

thank's for your help cooke

Maybe a stupid question but if the coil are 3-lug... where the wiring goes. Most of the coil in question are wiring in the first and the middle lugs. Is it ok....

thank's Gino

re: your question. Wiring to these 3-lug coils seems correct, according to this:
http://groups.google.ca/group/.....expander+3-lug+coils

But double check with the actual coils/wiring in your machine and against the schematics.

Update:
bit more info here:
http://groups.google.ca/group/.....expander+3-lug+coils

Is your solenoid expander relay (and bulb) activated/clicking ?

Cheers,
- Sylvain.

Thank,s Sylvain,

Yes the bulb and the expander solenoid relay click.

I just read the first post you refered to me and it's seem to have the same problem of mine. What about this 4 and 5 pin problem the guy describe...

Gino

P.S. are you around montreal one of these days....

If the 2nd diode/3-lug coils does not fix the issue, then it will be the following.
That would be the only remaining possibility, looking at the schematics and
reading again the description of the problem.

In order to fire both at once the Outhole kicker and Drop target 1,
and also separately the 4-drop target reset and the Drop target 2
(and probably also together the saucer and the 7 drop target reset?),
There must be a short or miswiring *between* the two lines leaving the
solenoid expander board to the controlled solenoid lines
(these are the top two horizontal lines in my pic below).
...assuming that the 2nd diode/3-lug coils are not the issue.

This is the only explanation left I think. Should be simple.

Unfortunately digging deeper would require looking at the machine
in-person (but we are too far apart).
Hopefully you will figure it out, with all the useful & generous MAACA
help/response posts.

Good luck !

Regards,
- Sylvain.

Quoted from sylvain

If the 2nd diode/3-lug coils does not fix the issue, then it will be the following.
That would be the only remaining possibility, looking at the schematics and
reading again the description of the problem.

In order to fire both at once the Outhole kicker and Drop target 1,
and also separately the 4-drop target reset and the Drop target 2
(and probably also together the saucer and the 7 drop target reset?),
There must be a short or miswiring *between* the two lines leaving the
solenoid expander board to the controlled solenoid lines
(these are the top two horizontal lines in my pic below).
...assuming that the 2nd diode/3-lug coils are not the issue.

This is the only explanation left I think. Should be simple.

Unfortunately digging deeper would require looking at the machine
in-person (but we are too far apart).
Hopefully you will figure it out, with all the useful & generous MAACA
help/response posts.

Good luck !

Regards,
- Sylvain.

Could this problem be caused by a bad/missing/broken diode on one of the coils controlled by the SEB?