is there any rough "schedule" worked out for the season?

any date/location set yet for the 1st meeting?

There is no schedule, if it goes like last season each month we just play it by ear and whoever volunteers to host first, there we go. I guess it should have been in its own thread but Doug already offered - first meeting tonight at his place from 5pm to 8pm. Hope to see you there. Anyone else in the area who wants to come out, just send a pm to Tuborg.

Sure thing.   I wasn't trying to hog the first OPL night - just making an opportunity for Kirsten (from Germany) to play...

TONIGHT!!!!!!

I am going to see if I can juggle some stuff around.... am I invited?

no way I could get out tonight. My wife needs my tools to do some stuff. We all know that when the wife needs tools, she also needs YOU to be the one using them while she tells you what to do

good luck guys!

It was just a small gathering and we didn't bother to record results. Sometime soon we should have a real start to the season, preferably with a bit more notice on the date & time.

So.... looking for volunteers to host this meeting. Anyone with at least 4 playable machines, pick a date & time, limit attendance if you wish.

Quoted from tinyrodent

It was just a small gathering and we didn't bother to record results. Sometime soon we should have a real start to the season, preferably with a bit more notice on the date & time.

So.... looking for volunteers to host this meeting. Anyone with at least 4 playable machines, pick a date & time, limit attendance if you wish.

I only have 2 playable.

How about I take the next/first offical meeting? The sys 11 are soon to be folded for ping pong/floor hockey so may as well get them played one last time and the Sterns are still all set up unless people want a rotation change before this meeting (I'm due for a change soon .

I'll check my weekend work schedule today and pick a Sat afternoon/evening in the next 2-4 weeks so lots of notice.

ME

Thank you very much for the hosting on short notice. I enjoyed the machines, in birlliant condition, very much. The TZ was really a challenge for me. Next time at home I'll see the BoPP with different eyes  

From the discussion about prices in Germany I think it's good to take a look into the Excel table from someone that tries to collect all machines that are sold with the condition. This includes ebay, portal, or somewhere else. The table comes from an German homepage:
(http://www.sb-werner.de/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=108&Itemid=83)
Klick on "(Klick auf den Screenshot)" beside the picture to download it, or on following link:
http://www.sb-werner.de/images/stories/Flipper/Flippermarkt_Beobachtung.xls

For the polishing of the mylar I used 3M Finesse-it polish and the extra fine one. The bottles I use are looking like on the following picture in the above right corner:
http://solutions.3mdeutschland.....ssetId=1173240901834
I tried to find similar stuff somewhere here but it seems that the IDs and sizes are different. Maybe the following link will help for the search:
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/po.....JR0R56gl4SMXJBJD69bl

I found an example of mylar polishing on http://www.pinballz.net (German portal). On the picture you can see a mylar border on the right side to the slingshot, but only by the color of the white.
Source of picture: http://www.pinballz.net/thread.php?postid=4207#post4207

For the playfields of the RfM, it seems that owner of the page has changed. I will check it and come back to you.

Pleas let me know if I forget something.
kia

Ah nuts! I missed a chance to play that sweet Sinbad!

Woohoo system 11s!!!

Crappola, I knew I forgot something... . Sorry I missed this Doug, I would have had the time too but haven't been on in a couple of days.

I heard someone mention you guys are getting WPR points?  How have you worked that into your system?  My brother is making monthly trips to the Ottawa area so if you guys are getting WPR points I'll be making the effort to hitch a ride with my brother and come out.  

Quoted from Vengeance

I heard someone mention you guys are getting WPR points?  How have you worked that into your system?  My brother is making monthly trips to the Ottawa area so if you guys are getting WPR points I'll be making the effort to hitch a ride with my brother and come out.  

Nope, where did you hear that? No points, nope, none. nope nope nope. No need to come to Ottawa and beat all of us. Nope.

On a more serious note, websherpa is gonna be dropping off a bunch of glass on my doorstep on Saturday Oct 3 around 1-1:30 pm. People are welcome to come play my machines while they wait for their glass.

Quoted from tinyrodent

We have a small league (http://ottawapinheads.ca) and it is about time to start our second season. Yoohoo would anyone like to volunteer to host for September?  Although the website doesn't show it yet, we have approval from IFPA to award points.

How do you get WPR points?  

Kirsten (the German guy) had a neat points system - sounded very "German" and precise.   If I understand the basics, it was you:

• a selection of machines - say 4 machines
  
• get to play 2-3 games on a machine and take the best score.
  
• some math normalization on the scores to give each player a ranking from 1..100.   Top ranking wins.
  

I'm sure I missed some details, I did like the idea of more than 1 game as one some of the earlier machine you need 2-3 games to find your "lucky" game.    

I like our OPL system though - simple and easy to understand for now.   So I'm just more curious about how WPR points are awarded.

I guess its all here in the FAQs (more reading to do instead of work...)
http://www.pinballrankings.com/

Adam, I was being sarcastic! You're more than welcome to come and take all our points.

Quoted from Tuborg

How do you get WPR points?  

Kirsten (the German guy) had a neat points system - sounded very "German" and precise.   If I understand the basics, it was you:

• a selection of machines - say 4 machines
  
• get to play 2-3 games on a machine and take the best score.
  
• some math normalization on the scores to give each player a ranking from 1..100.   Top ranking wins.
  

I'm sure I missed some details, I did like the idea of more than 1 game as one some of the earlier machine you need 2-3 games to find your "lucky" game.    

I like our OPL system though - simple and easy to understand for now.   So I'm just more curious about how WPR points are awarded.

I guess its all here in the FAQs (more reading to do instead of work...)
http://www.pinballrankings.com/

So you don't know how many points you are awarded?  

I thought you talked to the IFPA about this, they should have told you what your points were.

TOPL is:

8.33 Points for 1st place in the Playoffs
5 points for 2nd in the playoffs
3.33 points for 3rd in the playoffs.

Playoffs take precedent over season results as the season just acts as the qualifying period working up toward the playoffs.  

This is what the IFPA representative said to us:

Quoted Text

Your league would get a minimum of 25 points to distribute to the winner for a given calendar year. You can choose to award these all in one shot at the end of a season, or divide it up by the # of times you meet per year. We have leagues that do it both ways. Some reward ~2 points to the winner each month for 12 months, while others save them all for one shot at the end of the year.

jonny and I discussed it and I have a proposal but I'll hold off explaining the details until the website updates are done.

Yea that sounds right, because we have 3 playoffs a year that is where our 8.33 points comes from.

I'll be curious to see how you divvy your points out and then I'll be able to decide if it's worth the trip.  

Quoted from Vengeance

Yea that sounds right, because we have 3 playoffs a year that is where our 8.33 points comes from.

I'll be curious to see how you divvy your points out and then I'll be able to decide if it's worth the trip.  

Time to put all red flipper rubbers on the OPL games......

Quoted from Vengeance

Yea that sounds right, because we have 3 playoffs a year that is where our 8.33 points comes from.

I'll be curious to see how you divvy your points out and then I'll be able to decide if it's worth the trip.  

Isn't it worth the trip to hang out with fellow pinball fans and to play some pinball? What can you do with all these points anyways?

Quoted from jonny_eh

Isn't it worth the trip to hang out with fellow pinball fans and to play some pinball?

I can do that here in Toronto without a 5 hour drive, but it's always nice to see ME and Duane when I end up in the area.  

Quoted Text

What can you do with all these points anyways?

http://www.ifpapinball.com/?page_id=163

The only way you are allowed to compete is via the points system, so I'm just trying to ensure I get invited, points opportunities in the local area are few and far between so if I can possibly get a decent number of points within a 5 hour drive it makes it worth the trip.  

Wow, I guess that's a real business for you then!  I'm just playing for the fun times myself

Quoted from The Loafer

Wow, I guess that's a real business for you then!  I'm just playing for the fun times myself

Competition is the driving force behind pretty much everything I do in this hobby.  

Quoted from Vengeance

The only way you are allowed to compete is via the points system, so I'm just trying to ensure I get invited, points opportunities in the local area are few and far between so if I can possibly get a decent number of points within a 5 hour drive it makes it worth the trip.  

I sense Adam thinks the points are free for the taking in the OPL league       all he has to do is drive up and collect them  

I can't defend the points too well, its upto medvet & tinyrodent!

Quoted from Tuborg

I sense Adam thinks the points are free for the taking in the OPL league       all he has to do is drive up and collect them  

I can't defend the points too well, its upto medvet & tinyrodent!

Not true at all, I don't take anything for granted.  Like I said points in a local area are limited.  The only points opportunities in Toronto are TOPL and COTSB, but the Church points are so little it's hard to accumulate anything at all and TOPL points are only given out 3 times a year so there is alot of dead time when there are other tournaments going on in the US that I can't make.  Both are only 25 points total over the entire year where as since there are so many other tournaments run in the US that are all separate it's 25 points each tournament.  

The only stuff available in a reasonable driving distance are where you can get decent points are:

Michigan Pinball Open - once a year
PAPA - Once a year
Rochester Game room show - didn't happen his year
Niagara Pinball Show - First time this year
Canadian Pinball Championship - Second time

So if OPL becomes another reasonably close opportunity to get some points, why wouldn't you expect people who are actively trying to rank themselves in the world to make the trip to try and add to their overall total?

Just bugging you Adam.  I watched you play ST:TNG and you kick my butt.   Seeing Brett, Duane & Kirsten play, I realize I'm not a good player at all.   I basically try to keep the ball alive compared to these guys.   Funny, like say owning a guitar and not knowing how to play it, I have this odd feeling with TZ now after watching these guys playing it, I realizing how fun it could be.

They did say my TZ plays hard - so gotta lower the angle a bit...

Nothing wrong with having a try at more points. That being said, I'm pretty sure Ottawa has some skills to bring to the table  

Just not me in particular.

Quoted from Tuborg

How do you get WPR points?  

Kirsten (the German guy) had a neat points system - sounded very "German" and precise.   If I understand the basics, it was you:

• a selection of machines - say 4 machines
  
• get to play 2-3 games on a machine and take the best score.
  
• some math normalization on the scores to give each player a ranking from 1..100.   Top ranking wins.
  

I'm sure I missed some details, I did like the idea of more than 1 game as one some of the earlier machine you need 2-3 games to find your "lucky" game.    

I like our OPL system though - simple and easy to understand for now.   So I'm just more curious about how WPR points are awarded.

I guess its all here in the FAQs (more reading to do instead of work...)
http://www.pinballrankings.com/

Hi Doug,
you get it right. This is valid for the group I'm playing in. Generally each group can decide there own system of getting a ranking over the year in there group. Once a year we are playing a final, over last years it happened between April and May. For the final the best 3 of each group is allowed to go to the final. There is an exception for the group from Munich, because they have 3 times the player then other groups and can send 5 (if I remember correct). The playsystem/rules for the final are decided by the one who makes the final possible. In Germany it is not commercial!
The WPR points are only possible in this tournament, not over the year!

From the IFPA it is allowed to do once a year a closed tournament with WPR points, this is the final we do.

I just searched for some English description, but couldn't find one. Maybe some can read the German stuff, then this should be interesting:
http://www.pinball-heaven.de/spieleabende.htm
Marco, the owner of the side, wrote a nice software for tournaments that are using the swiss system adopted for pinball (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_system_tournament). I think this is not the right place to write about pinball point systems  

Hope I could clarify the WPR points.

Quoted from kia

From the IFPA it is allowed to do once a year a closed tournament with WPR points, this is the final we do.

I think that may be a translation issue because as far as I know you are not allowed at all to have a closed tournament and still receive WPR points.  That is the reason why the PAPA B and C division aren't eligible for WPR points.  

Quoted from Vengeance

I think that may be a translation issue because as far as I know you are not allowed at all to have a closed tournament and still receive WPR points.  That is the reason why the PAPA B and C division aren't eligible for WPR points.  

I just re-checked the stuff with closed tournaments. Since this year, at least in Germany it is possible.
Reference: http://www.pinballz.net/thread.php?threadid=8587&hilight=geschlossenen+Turnieren

Marco (nick: spyhunter) is the responsible person in Germany to order that the closed tournament gets WPR points.

I can't read that cause it's in German I'll try and convert it with Google tomorrow to see if I can read it.

But the only instance I know of where you can close a tournament and still receive points is on a Country level.  As an example. the Canadian Pinball Championship was closed to Canadians only so only Canadians were allowed to participate but you were still able to receive WPR points.  I can only assume that maybe this would be the same thing but it would possibly be a German championship or something where only Germans would be allowed to partake.  But I can't see how any small local tournament would be allowed to close their tournament and still get points when PAPA the worlds largest tournament in the World can't get points for their B and C division, which I would argue holds more talent in those two divisions that any local league or tournament could ever hope to get.  

Quoted from Vengeance

So if OPL becomes another reasonably close opportunity to get some points, why wouldn't you expect people who are actively trying to rank themselves in the world to make the trip to try and add to their overall total?

For this reason I vote we keep OPL out of the "World Rankings"....I've been having a great time playing in our little league, with our MAACA members, who are just there to have fun.
Getting all fussy about rules/points really drains the fun out of pinball in my opinion.....

Quoted from Hippochrome

For this reason I vote we keep OPL out of the "World Rankings"....I've been having a great time playing in our little league, with our MAACA members, who are just there to have fun.
Getting all fussy about rules/points really drains the fun out of pinball in my opinion.....

And we'll do the points thing as long as they don't interfere with the fun. If people start to get anal about points and procedure we'll scrap them. We're not committed to anything.

Quoted from Hippochrome

For this reason I vote we keep OPL out of the "World Rankings"....I've been having a great time playing in our little league, with our MAACA members, who are just there to have fun.
Getting all fussy about rules/points really drains the fun out of pinball in my opinion.....

I'll have to order a titl-bob for TZ, too!

Quoted from jonny_eh

And we'll do the points thing as long as they don't interfere with the fun. If people start to get anal about points and procedure we'll scrap them. We're not committed to anything.

I have the same view about the MPL. I have the TOPL rules, but I intend to be flexible. People will pay to be in our league but that will be strictly to cover prizes, the website and the stats. Keep it simple and have fun.

I was confused to begin with when OPL decided they wanted WPR points in the first place.  You guys obviously aren't interestead in competing on the world stage or interestead in the attention it brings, which is fine there is nothing wrong with just being a casual league.  But why you want to receive WPR points seems unclear to me.  

Quoted from jonny_eh

And we'll do the points thing as long as they don't interfere with the fun. If people start to get anal about points and procedure we'll scrap them. We're not committed to anything.

I totally agree. I just wanna play pinball.

Quoted from Vengeance

I was confused to begin with when OPL decided they wanted WPR points in the first place.  You guys obviously aren't interestead in competing on the world stage or interestead in the attention it brings, which is fine there is nothing wrong with just being a casual league.  But why you want to receive WPR points seems unclear to me.  

Because it's kinda cool to feel connected to the pinball community at large. It also gives us something of 'value' to hand out to winners without having to spend a dime.

Quoted from jonny_eh

Because it's kinda cool to feel connected to the pinball community at large. It also gives us something of 'value' to hand out to winners without having to spend a dime.

I guess, but what value does it hold to someone who isn't going venture past Ottawa to compete?  I could understand if you were trying to increase exposure of the league and try and bring in more people to compete but it doesn't sounds like that is the focus and almost seems like an unwanted result of giving out points.  The only real value of the points is to a person who is trying to get an invite into the IFPA World Pinball Championship.

To me it sounds more like you might want to submit your results to the PARS system:

http://www.papa.org/pars/

That way you can still connect your league to the pinball community as a whole and see how you rank without the unwanted result of attracting world class players who are only interestead in playing in the league for the points.  

You can do both if you really want, PARS and WPR, the difference is people aren't going to travel to get PARS points.

Wasn't aware of PARS, may be worth looking into.

Quoted from Vengeance

I can't read that cause it's in German I'll try and convert it with Google tomorrow to see if I can read it.

But the only instance I know of where you can close a tournament and still receive points is on a Country level.  As an example. the Canadian Pinball Championship was closed to Canadians only so only Canadians were allowed to participate but you were still able to receive WPR points.  I can only assume that maybe this would be the same thing but it would possibly be a German championship or something where only Germans would be allowed to partake.  But I can't see how any small local tournament would be allowed to close their tournament and still get points when PAPA the worlds largest tournament in the World can't get points for their B and C division, which I would argue holds more talent in those two divisions that any local league or tournament could ever hope to get.  

Your example hits it on the point. The closed tournament for the best player of the leagues. I think its not the biggest over the year, but a big one. At the moment there are 23 leagues in Germany, so for the next final in 2010 there will be round 22*3+5=71 players (+5 for the big group from Munich).
The discussion about the WPR points is similar like it started here. Some are very keen on and other only want to have fun. I like competition and playing for fun, but I'm not interested in the points.
Anybody has it's own way  

Update for a missing information ...

Quoted from kia

...
For the playfields of the RfM, it seems that owner of the page has changed. I will check it and come back to you.
...

I just get a mail that the page were it was possible to get AfM playfields is correct, but they are all sold out.
http://www.highclasspinballs.com/index.php?language=en
And it's still the same owner of the page.

Quoted from kia

Your example hits it on the point. The closed tournament for the best player of the leagues. I think its not the biggest over the year, but a big one. At the moment there are 23 leagues in Germany, so for the next final in 2010 there will be round 22*3+5=71 players (+5 for the big group from Munich).
The discussion about the WPR points is similar like it started here. Some are very keen on and other only want to have fun. I like competition and playing for fun, but I'm not interested in the points.
Anybody has it's own way  

That makes more sense.

Hey Kia on another note, since you read German, I've been thinking about ordering some stuff from these guys:

http://www.pinball-dreams.com/index.php?article_id=15&clang=0

But the language barrier makes it pretty hard, you seem to do pretty well with English considering it's not your first language, think you might be able to help out?

Quoted from Vengeance

...
Hey Kia on another note, since you read German, I've been thinking about ordering some stuff from these guys:

http://www.pinball-dreams.com/index.php?article_id=15&clang=0

But the language barrier makes it pretty hard, you seem to do pretty well with English considering it's not your first language, think you might be able to help out?

Yes, no problem. Let me know what you want to have translated. It is also possible to write Henrik or Alex a mail. I think beside German and English also French should be possible, but for French I'm not sure. I page is continuously growing, but at the moment they have much work, so I think the English version need some time.
I know them very well, we meet at least twice a year with there complete league for friendship competition and some beer  

I just tried babel fish and it looks that it is working. Of course some words does not work, but most is understandable.
http://babelfish.yahoo.com/tra.....p;btnTrUrl=Translate

For special words you can use LEO. I think you don't have to understand the German, fill in the word in the white field and normally you get a very good result.
http://dict.leo.org/ende?lang=de&lp=ende&search=

Anyway I know sometimes it's annoying to work with translation, so let me know what you want to have translated. Hopefully not a complete book  

@Vengeance:
Is the babelfish OK, or do you need further support?

Yea I can read threw the website with that, thanks.

Problem comes when actually contacting them to get a quote and make a payment, I tried once a few months ago but the language barrier caused a bit of a problem

when I contact them again I'll send you a message if I have a problem again.

Thanks

Adam

Quoted from Vengeance

Yea I can read threw the website with that, thanks.

Problem comes when actually contacting them to get a quote and make a payment, I tried once a few months ago but the language barrier caused a bit of a problem

when I contact them again I'll send you a message if I have a problem again.

Thanks

Adam

OK, if you need something, send me a PM.