What TTL setting does RFM require? Sorry if you already talked about it.
Have
Want
-The Getaway: High Speed II!! -Spider-Man -F-14 Tomcat -Guns N' Roses -Lord of the Rings -Twilight Zone
-Medieval Madness! -Indiana Jones (Williams) -Star Trek: The Next Generation -Champion Pub -Terminator 3 -Congo -Johnny Mnemonic -Tales of the Arabian Nights
What TTL setting does RFM require? Sorry if you already talked about it.
It is progammed to send packets with TTL=1. So they don't even make the first hop since the router ignores them (logically, since the first hop is the router so it knows it's wasting it's time). I dunno how many TTL hops are required but Jim has specified 64 which I am certain is more than sufficient given the multiple routes packets can go on the internet.
As far as I can tell it was fine with TTL of 1 for local use and that was all that was intended at the time.
Here is the command which specifies TTL of 64. To my knowledge it does nothing in my router since it doesn't appear to have the iptables-extra required in the flash which includes the TTL support.
Oh, I see. Pretty weird for them to set TTL to 1, even if it was only intended for local play. They should have just used the default 64/128 that everything else uses.
BTW, I have a WRT54GL, with dd-wrt. I highly recommend it. Would the nucore system be capable of uploading tournament scores? Why hasn't Stern clued into this yet?
Have
Want
-The Getaway: High Speed II!! -Spider-Man -F-14 Tomcat -Guns N' Roses -Lord of the Rings -Twilight Zone
-Medieval Madness! -Indiana Jones (Williams) -Star Trek: The Next Generation -Champion Pub -Terminator 3 -Congo -Johnny Mnemonic -Tales of the Arabian Nights
Oh, I see. Pretty weird for them to set TTL to 1, even if it was only intended for local play. They should have just used the default 64/128 that everything else uses.
BTW, I have a WRT54GL, with dd-wrt. I highly recommend it. Would the nucore system be capable of uploading tournament scores? Why hasn't Stern clued into this yet?
Hello Everyone,
It is indeed a strange decision to make. When I was writing my system I assumed it was set to 64 but during the packet reading tests it was discovered to be set to 1. I may release a patch for the game code in the future, but at the moment my setup details found at http://www.mypinballs.com/tournament/core/techsetup.jsp are the easiest way to get your rfm connected. Setup should not take long if you use the default confg file on there.
I have been in discussions with the nucore guys regarding adding some custom stuff for their system including this ttl fix. I think this will be something for after the initial release.
Sterns seem to have gone in the opposite direction regarding tournaments. I think thats a bit odd. Maybe I should add an icon on my site for people to use saying 'Network Required'
I am trying to get scores to record here.... for what it's worth.
You get your top score on the score list and you get a unlimited backup of all the rfm scores you've ever had. The backup function is something I will be expanding on with future software releases. I don't know of any other system which preserves your score history.
It is indeed a strange decision to make. When I was writing my system I assumed it was set to 64 but during the packet reading tests it was discovered to be set to 1. I may release a patch for the game code in the future, but at the moment my setup details found at http://www.mypinballs.com/tournament/core/techsetup.jsp are the easiest way to get your rfm connected. Setup should not take long if you use the default confg file on there.
I have been in discussions with the nucore guys regarding adding some custom stuff for their system including this ttl fix. I think this will be something for after the initial release.
Sterns seem to have gone in the opposite direction regarding tournaments. I think thats a bit odd. Maybe I should add an icon on my site for people to use saying 'Network Required'
So it was a mistake, ok, that makes sense. It's a shame you never got a chance to correct it, and more games weren't made to take advantage of this forward thinking idea.
Are you saying that you're actually able to release new game code? That'd be pretty cool, especially after all this time. I doubt that any of the license holders would object, it just adds value to the license.
Have
Want
-The Getaway: High Speed II!! -Spider-Man -F-14 Tomcat -Guns N' Roses -Lord of the Rings -Twilight Zone
-Medieval Madness! -Indiana Jones (Williams) -Star Trek: The Next Generation -Champion Pub -Terminator 3 -Congo -Johnny Mnemonic -Tales of the Arabian Nights
I doubt that any of the license holders would object, it just adds value to the license.
Actually they would. WMS, IPB and TPF are still active in licensing.
I was just a PinExpo, and after seeing the Nucore presentation, and personally talking to Gene (IPB), Chuck (Nucore), Ted Estes and Cameron Silver...(Yes...that's my name dropping...). WMS and everyone else involved are still very active with the rights to their code. The will aggresively pursue unlicensed versions. A recent case in point was the modified NGG's for charity. The modifed Rom code got them into trouble.
Actually they would. WMS, IPB and TPF are still active in licensing.
I was just a PinExpo, and after seeing the Nucore presentation, and personally talking to Gene (IPB), Chuck (Nucore), Ted Estes and Cameron Silver...(Yes...that's my name dropping...). WMS and everyone else involved are still very active with the rights to their code. The will aggresively pursue unlicensed versions. A recent case in point was the modified NGG's for charity. The modifed Rom code got them into trouble.
And that is why I have not modified anything that belongs to Williams, or any one else. My system is 100% original, and works with stock williams code. This is a very important point. I have no source code from the original games and am not part of the original design team.
Please remember that my instructions are to use a WRT54GL router as part of your network and upload a config file from my site. A lot of the discussion here is trying to get a non supported router to work with my system.
So it was a mistake, ok, that makes sense. It's a shame you never got a chance to correct it, and more games weren't made to take advantage of this forward thinking idea.
Are you saying that you're actually able to release new game code? That'd be pretty cool, especially after all this time. I doubt that any of the license holders would object, it just adds value to the license.
The williams guys released what was an amazing system for the time, so I wouldn't say it was a mistake. The system did what they wanted it to do. I am using additional hardware to allow stock game code to be used in a new way, which i think fits together quite nicely.
I am not going to be releasing any game code updates nor would i want to. I was just suggesting that a patch for a singular issue is possible in theory. Obviously the licence holder holds all the cards and i'm happy with how my system works anyway. Most people are going to need some sort of wireless router in their 'games room' regardless.
All my updates will be to my tournament system code, which i own outright.
Please remember that my instructions are to use a WRT54GL router as part of your network and upload a config file from my site. A lot of the discussion here is trying to get a non supported router to work with my system.
Jim
Agreed.
Welcome Jim.
I was working under the premis that any third party flashed router that could run in client mode and handle the TTL modification command (which you make quite clear is critical) would work. Unfortunately the lack of TTL support and the omission of iptables extras in Micro flash versions of DD-WRT is poorly documented. It is in fact a red herring as I stated that DD-WRT indicates iptables support. I suggest it should state "limited iptables support". Jim states use of the GL. It's still available here in Canada (cheap) if anyone is interested in getting a NIB one. When I started this project, I picked up a G since Futureshop had them locally. Jim has always stated use the GL since he has tested the use of that model.
Had this not been the case. The system would have been running quickly. There are some idiosyncrasies involved in port forwarding that may need some better clarification, but had the TTL command worked it I would have ruled those out quickly. Furthermore the example given is on a 10.0 network which is not the default configuration for the Linksys routers I have worked with (maybe the GL is different, yet to be seen). I would suggest giving examples on a 192.168.1.0 and 192.168.2.0 net and sub net would be easier to translate. The config file is good for only one specific model/version of router and network configuration. If your not careful that you have exactly the same router it can lead to problems as witness here with bricking it. My preference is to enter the information, specific to my current network and router.
I have a WRT54GL lined up and a WRT54G V4 coming. I will attempt to configure the G just for the purpose of insuring it was in fact the Micro version of DD-WRT that was not compatible with TTL support.
As to the licensing issues I am disappointed to see those that have no apparent use for the code creating obstacles. I do not see how these individuals can profit from the code any further since the business model is based on selling machines that run the code and not the code itself. They aren't building or selling any NGG's, RFM's or titles anymore and appeared to have zero interest to do so with any platforms after Oct 25 1999.
I wonder what sort of issues these chaps are running into?
jonny_eh
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