I was trying to think of a way to finance all the machines I want to purchase over the next few years and I was wondering...

Can a person still make money on pinball machines?  What kind of location do you need to get into?  Does anyone still make enough money to actually pay off the machine over time?  How long does it take?

If I could put 3 or 4 machines on location and have them paid off over 3 years that sounds like a good plan to me.  But - does is work??  Anyone??...

Probably not worth it IMHO.

buy a machine already !!  STOP OBSESSING !! ... oh wait ..  welcome !!

There have been many posts over the years here and the general opinion is you do not make money on pinball. The days off finding pins at cheap prices are over. Even the operators have become educated.

View pinball for what it is: a hobby and enjoy it!!!

My two cents.  

Quoted from sinpin

Can a person still make money on pinball machines?

http://hem.bredband.net/molander1/FUNNYGUY.WAV

It used to be that you could buy them cheap, sell them at a profit, but that has increasingly become difficult with the rise in popularity of the hobby.  Puting the machines on location is cost prohibitive because you need to get individual operating licenses for each machine, insurance,  maintenance, and you share your income 50/50 with the location owner. In most places you'd be lucky to rake in 20$/week BEFORE sharing and deducting operating costs..  If you put older/cheaper machines, less people will put money in them.

Bottom line is that if you're looking for a way to get free machines, you'll be disapointed.

Spreading the word through your family/friends/neighbours is best way to get a good deal on a machine in someone's basement that's collecting dust.  Of course don't expect a nice, pristine, or even working machine in that case.

My 0.02$

Mike

Quoted from sinpin

Can a person still make money on pinball machines?  

In a word ...   No .

--

I assume your intent was to make money on location
rather than flipping for profit.

You'll get very little money on location after you consider
permits, coin-ops licenses, insurance, profit sharing with location, etc...,

and worse yet, your games will get beat-up and/or you'll be spending alot time
repairing them

Just not worth it...

Like others have said,  this is not a hobby to make money.
You'll be lucky to break-even....

Steph

As others have said, you cann't make money with pinball. You are looking at expensive games. If money is an issue, then start small and do the trade up program. The one really, really nice thing with pinball is that prices (at least for the last 10 years) have stayed constant OR increased. This means if you buy a decent game for $1,000 today and take care of it, it will be worth a $1,000 next year.

When starting out, I suggest to friends they spend $1,000 or so for a decent game. If they can afford it, go to $1,500 and buy a reasonable DMD. Save up and in a year or so, sell the game you have a buy a different game. Lather rinse, repeat.

Duane

I briefly researched the aspect of operating machines (my uncle did it for a living in the late 60's - 80's), but unless you have a large operation and cater to the newer machines AND are located in Quebec   it's difficult.  In Ontario at least there are a lot of crooks who protect their routes fibourously because they don't make much, and then there is Starburst.  The best "business plan" that I could come up with was renting machines to businesses for their relaxation rooms or to raise money for charity, but the associated costs and time moving pins around makes it less attractive EVEN as just a part time way to raise pinball funds.  The truth about pinball machines, particularly off route ones is that they break down, a lot, and unexpectedly.  They require constant service (even in a Home Environment).

So far, in order to finance my "habit" er I mean hobby, is to buy cheap project machines, fix them up a bit, enjoy them and then sell them or better yet trade them for a meagre profit.  Trade-ups works better because you can turn a low cost but highly appreciated pin or two into a more highly appreciated pin without exchanging too much cash.  AS soon as you start selling for cash, it becomes more difficult to realize the appreciation in value that you'd like to achieve (book value) because, amongst collectors at least, everyone wants a deal unless it's either highly collectible, or a HUO machine.  Now all that being said, the hobby has seen our retirement investments diminished slightly, and our on hand pinball stock increase, but there is more coming IN the door, than going out...so the economics are not working the way I had envisioned (i.e. buy low, sell high, get better pinballs).  It's more like Buy Low, spend oodles of time and money to refurbish, Keep Pin, Buy Higher.... Panic Attack, Sell Low....and so on.

All that being said, there are regulars on this board that are in the business of either routing machines or selling machines retail.

Absolutely no way..trust me!  But if you're slightly insane and enjoy losing a few bucks, there aren't too many ways that are as much fun!

You know, I disagree with every opinion in this thread. I am in the Vending machine business, Chips, Chocolate Bars, POP (Coke, Pepsi etc.) Bulk Candy, and, yes, a few games as well, and it is essentially the same idea. You will make some money doing it if you have a machine or two but that business is not designed for the casual part time business. It is all based on Volume. Every machine helps pull the weight of every other machine. Obviously Location Location Location is THE main factor to success. Everyone is saying $20.00 to $50.00 a week, who cares, but if you have 10 machines making $20.00 to $50.00 a week, $200 to $500 a week isn't so bad for 1 days work. You alone would have to decide what is the minimum acceptable amount and move them if they are below that rate. The same principle applies to games, Location Location Location!! High volume is necessary and sprinkling some good vids to help pay the bills is a good plan. You need good fun machines to the casual player and good challenging pins to the serious player. Congo comes to mind, as well as WH2O for starters, maybe a No Fear, or a Demolition Man, etc. But if you have 10 games operating that you can get for a fair price (Read Cheap!) have them working very well, resolder all wires on Solenoids and switches before it goes out as pins move and wires and solder break. Keep a "route box" of parts etc. and know how to fix Everything yourself, and don't look at it as a sprint, but as a slow and steady, kind of thing I think (Well, I know) it can work. My number 1 location problem is Coin jams, Kids put crap in coin mechs hoping to get free games.

The other thing that bugs me about this thread is every opinion here so far, is driving another nail into the coffin of Pinball in the public. Everyone asks where to play in the public but everyone also says it is ridiculous for anyone to try to put games out there. I think we should encourage and support the small operator instead of telling him not to waste his time. I ALWAYS play every pin I find on location.

So SinPin, Go for it! But I would seriously take the time to learn how Pins work and what is involved in repairing them. Be selective where you put them with abuse in mind, and go slow and don't expect to make thousands of $$$ on hundreds in investment. It probably isn't going to make you huge dollars but you can certainly make a bit of cash and wind up with a few games that you can flip towards other games.

Dave (Operating 2 Pins and 4 vids at this time, but have had double that out there)

Hey thanks Dave...  I needed someone to tell me what I wanted to hear.  I see what everyone else is saying as well.  It is obvious I am not going to make thousands of dollars but if I start this as a business and can show revenue Canada a "potential" to make money then I can write my first 3 years of losses against my personal income.

So in effect, the taxes I pay as a hard working "citizen" can assist with paying my expenses (machines, etc) on my vending business.  One of the main stipulations of this is there has to be an ability to make money and you can only write off losses for the first 3 years.  After that you have to either be profitable or pay the losses yourself.  

I think I am going to brainstorm 10 or so locations.  Then, I will go to those locations and survey the people hanging about.  Would you play pinball?  Do you like pinball?  What do you think of these games?  (flash to some nice big pics of a few machines).  If I can find some interest - maybe it can work?  My first thought is that people in the tech business or telemarketing business would enjoy cranking off a few games to reduce stress on breaks or lunches.  That is where I am going to start....  well, actually I need to buy a couple machines first so I can mess around and get some idea of how the hell they work