A BIG thank you to Neo for an *awesome* job on my pharaoh.

I think the pictures speak for themselves:

Before:
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_38
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_52
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_49?full=1

After:
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_71?full=1
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_68
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org/gallery/pharaoh/pharaoh_65

I've done a few playfields myself and I knew the work involved and let me tell you, Neo's work is a real bargain ! 2 thumbs way up for him if you're thinking about sending a playfield.  I've seen (and installed) 2 Bill Davis playfields and I would not hesitate to send other playfields to Neo. Turnaround time: 3 1/2 months.

THANKS!
Phil
http://mrhide.pinnesota.org

mess, he's back.

Where have you been, Phil? Kid got your tongue?

Quoted from necro_nemesis

mess, he's back.

Well you will know what he will be doing for the next few days at least  

Lookin' Sexy!

Now let's see if we can convince Mike and Kevin at CPR to make some plastics

-cyBORG

....or a backglass ?!   you're the only one with that power

Just received a bill from Fedex for 75$ .... phreaking bastards sure took their time
so,
60$ or so to ship it once + ~ 40-50 bucks of customs to GO to the states
350$ for clear and touchups.
50$ to ship it back
75$ of customs
_______
535$

+
300$ for a broken backglass
250$ for a good backglass
______
1085$

+ 350$ what I paid the entire game
_____
1435$

...and I haven't even started to put it back together nor calculate the parts...

At least its a hard to find game... hopefully you will like it as much as you spent/worked on it, it will be a nice one for sure !

Thats a proof that restoring a game can be much more costy than buying a nice one outright (of course, when a game is rare, this is not always an option).

Quoted from Mrhide

Just received a bill from Fedex for 75$ .... phreaking bastards sure took their time
so,
60$ or so to ship it once + ~ 40-50 bucks of customs to GO to the states
350$ for clear and touchups.
50$ to ship it back
75$ of customs
_______
535$

+
300$ for a broken backglass
250$ for a good backglass
______
1085$

+ 350$ what I paid the entire game
_____
1435$

...and I haven't even started to put it back together nor calculate the parts...

Hence the reason very few will attempt to restore one of these machines to perfection. Unless you absolutely love the title and are going to keep it. It doesn't cover the cost of the restoration on the resale let alone your time.

You can sink that kind of coin into a $3K plus machine and possibly recover from it, so basically anything below A list you should pay the extra for a nice one, even in some cases when it's several hundred more.

I would see if you can get one of the sending duties back from the goverment.
Because they did not purchase it it was still yours and was a repair so that can;t charge you duties on something you already own!.
Thats plain a** stupid.

Actually looked up the info there should be no duties for either.

Memorandum D8-2-26
Ottawa, October 30, 1998

Subject
Goods re-entered after repair or alteration in the United States, Mexico, Chile, Israel, or another CIFTA beneficiary
This Memorandum outlines the conditions under which goods may be returned to Canada duty free after being exported to a free trade partner for repair or alteration under tariff item Nos. 9971.00.00 and 9992.00.00 in the List of Tariff Provisions set out in the schedule to the Customs Tariff.

Here is the link
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pub/cm/d8-2-26/d8-2-26-e.html

Good luck

It's not duty. It's a brokerage fee. You have to pay it regardless of who owns the item because someone has to complete customs paperwork no matter what.

75$ in brokerage thats just stupid they f*** up on the paper work or paid duty on the item that they where not suppose too.

For the record, if the shipment are sent Fedex Ground or UPS, there is always a brokerage fee, as has been stated on this thread, someone has to fill out the forms for customs. However if you ship FedEX International Priority (Overnight service) or Fedex International Economy (2-3 day service), brokerage fees are included in the courier fees, as FedEx clears them with their in-house brokers. Since this is a air service, the fees are obviously higher than the ground service, but there is no brokerage fee and it is a faster service. This way you do not get a brokerage bill after the shipment arrives. Obviously, any duties, GST or other taxes are extra.

BTW I never got any insurance money from the pharaoh backglass I bought after fightning and waiting for countless hours on the phone so for 75$, it's not worth my time to fight for it ... and it was ground so it's indeed brokerage fees ...

Quoted from Mrhide

Just received a bill from Fedex for 75$ .... phreaking bastards sure took their time
so,
.

I also got one of those "surprise" bills from Fedex for a Marco shipment.  First time from Fedex, usuaslly they're from UPS.  Now Fedex at least includes the brokerage fee, so this was for GST and Duty (no handling charges).  HOWEVER, they freakin got the Harmonized code wrong, they charged me duty on a "Glass Display" (Other Glassware) instead of a "Vacuum Flourescent Displays" which is a Duty Free item... Grrr.  You can put in for a change, and well, hold your breath.  So make sure, if you can, to do your homework and ge the suppliers to put on the correct (or to your advantage) harmonized code or content description in a commercial invoice, otherwise it's open for interpretation.

Most Pinball stuff used to be classified as Amusement Parts, and not dutiable, but I'm having trouble finding that harmonized code again....

... I would think that services (like restoration and coating of a pinball playfield) would also be a Duty Free item, but I could be wrong, any trans-border shipping experts here?

Actually, I just went through the Canada Customs Tariff, and got on the phone with Border services, and the correct harmonized code to give exporters (or to have when you're crossing the border) for Pinballs, arcade machines and thie parts are as follows:

9504.30.00 -Other games, operated by coins, banknotes, bank cards, tokens or by
other means of payment, other than bowling alley equipment
Issued January 2, 2007
11 - - - - - -Video.................................................................................................... NMB
19 - - - - - -Other .................................................................................................... NMB
90 - - - - -Parts and accessories............................................................................ -

All these items are Duty Free from Most Favoured Nations (including the USA).   So, for example, 9504.30.19 for pinball machines, and 9504.30.11 for video arcade machines, and 9504.30.90 for Parts and Accessories for both.  I'll let my common suppliers know this and perhaps they can start marking up shipments to Canada this way.

On Services and Repairs, Duty is not applicable, however GST is applicable if you supply a Business Number, and PST and GST are applicable for casual or retail purchase.

If it's not here already, perhaps we should put up a separate "sticky" message with this info.

It's been posted here before, but it's worth posting again.  Very good info on customs:
http://www.cgcc.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7594

Quoted from websherpa

, they charged me duty on a "Glass Display" (Other Glassware) instead of a "Vacuum Flourescent Displays" which is a Duty Free item...

A bit of trivia here..  The only company that ever had VFD's was Gottlieb (The blue displays).  VFDs are pretty much always blue and are low voltage.

Regular pinball display glass is 'gas plasma' and that includes DMDs.


Mike

Thanks Mike, and actually, because the parts would be used in the repair of a pinball machine, they can just be lumped into 9504.30.90 for Parts and Accessories for coin-operated machines.

Just because something is a "part" doesn't mean you can use the part provision in the harmonized tariff.

Eg:  You get a set of screws for your pinball machine - so therefore its a part.. well no, According to the General Interperative Rules (GIR) you have to classify them as a screw. (Insert very long winded GIR rules here)

Don't be surprised if you get your suppliers to put on the HS number for a Part only to have the broker (correctly) reclassify as something else.  Brokers do make mistakes, they are only doing their jobs to the best of the description provided.  When looking up HS numbers to give to your suppliers, make sure you follow the GIR. With customs new AMPS system, its not the broker who gets fined if they classify something wrong.. its the IMPORTER (aka you!).


If you ever need a second opinion on a customs bill, feel free to PM or email it to me.  


as for them misclassifying, when you get the bill, attach with a letter stating they were incorrect, and shortpay it.

Goods shipped to the US, and returned come back duty free, and tax exempt.  If someone worked on it, then the value of the repair is dutiable and subject to tax(es).  Warranty repairs are duty free and tax exempt.

That CGCC sticky is nice, alot of good information, and no I am not biased...

You don't have to get Fedex to be your broker, its your choice who you use.  Call around, most places will do it cheaper then fedex will.  Check yellow pages under customs brokerage.  If you live in an area, where fedex has their warehouse, you can even do it yourself.  The problem is that if fedex brings it in Windsor, and your located in Montreal.. your screwed to do it yourself.


Subpacket
(Your friendly professionally licensed customs broker)

I was referring only to the Score Display tube, assuming it's not a particularly generic part (although certainly it could be used in instrument panels, etc. the classification are likely to be similarly Duty Free).  In this particular case it came in a mixed parts shipment, with a detailed commercial invoice, clearly marked pinball parts, but the broker simply copied in the first item on the invoice "Display Glass....something or other" and likely his computer spit up the HC for a likely match, which was for an item of Glass meant for Display (which is dutiable).  


Can you help clarify this "If someone worked on it, then the value of the repair is dutiable and subject to tax(es).  Warranty repairs are duty free and tax exempt."?

I can see mention of paid repairs being Dutiable, but can't find the exact HC and Tarrifs. Do you have a reference for HC and Tariff rates for dutiable repairs (other than GST/PST)?  It would be worth having this info handy, for example for a playfield restoration. I may have assumed incorrectly that non-warranty repairs were duty free (I always knew they were subject to sales taxes).  

I can see reference to: Tariff Items Nos. 9971.00.00 and 9992.00.00 Accounting Regulations  as follows:

1. Tariff item No. 9992.00.00 of the schedule to the Customs Tariff provides customs duty-free importation of goods which are returned to Canada, regardless of country of origin, after having been exported for repair or alteration in the United States, Mexico, Chile, Israel, or a Canada-Israel Free Trade Agreement (CIFTA) beneficiary.

2. The provision allows customs duty-free entry on the full value (export value and the foreign value added) of the returned goods, which were temporarily exported to a free trade partner (United States, Mexico, Chile, Israel, or a CIFTA beneficiary) for repair or alteration. At the time of import no customs duty is paid on the value of the repair or alteration. However, duties under the Excise Tax Act including the goods and services tax (GST) and excise tax, if applicable, are payable on the foreign value added. Where excisable goods are repaired abroad, and the value is enhanced, excise tax is payable on the duty-paid value of the enhancement. For duty purposes, this provision applies to qualifying goods regardless of whether the repair or alteration is under warranty or not and regardless of whether the repair or alteration could have been performed in Canada.

3. Free trade partner means:

(a) a NAFTA country;

(b) Chile; or

(c) Israel or another CIFTA beneficiary.


Doesn't that indicate Duty Free on Re-import of repaired goods? (But subject, as always to GST and potentially PST on the value of the repair?

I will get the actual numbers on Monday.. but let me put it like this..

YOu have a playfield that looks like mess.  Its worth $250.00.  You send it down to Chris who touches it up, and makes it freakin sweet.  He charges you $1000.  That playfield is now worth $1250.  (your total costs on that playfield - ignoring shipping)

WHen that playfield comes back, its being returned as a better product, a product worth $1250.  You already paid duty/pst/gst on $250.00 of it.  So that becomes exempt.

You would have to pay Duty (free) + GST (6%) + pst (8% - ontario) or $140.00.

(The amount that the playfield has been improved is still subject to duty / tax)

So, you get that playfield, and there is a mistake on it.  One of the inserts isnt flush.. so you ship it down to CHris and he fixes it under warranty.

When it comes back, its warranty repair.. You still have an entry, the duty is removed, and there is no PST / GST.


(There are other conditions when they ship you a new playfield under warranty replacement - that is duty free, but believe or not subject to PST/GST.. thats a pisser, and then there is Canadian Goods Returned - which is Duty free and tax exempt)

I will edit this post with relevant HS numbers and special authority codes, and update the cgcc site as well.


Always check over your invoices that you get from your shipping company / broker.  They can only go by what they think, and are doing the (sometimes) best they can.  Most are good about fixing their mistakes (peacebridge - who handles Canada Post entries) and some are just jerks.  If anyone does get one that is right out of whack, question it.

Quoted from Mrhide

Just received a bill from Fedex for 75$ .... phreaking bastards sure took their time


60$ or so to ship it once + ~ 40-50 bucks of customs to GO to the states

Now you have incentive to use CanadaPost the next time to send the playfield.  
You should have only gotten hit with brokerage fees for it to leave the states, not enter but i guess FedEx Ground just had to reach their quota that day...

Mr Hide - do me a favour, scan and email all your customs bills.  alternatively, you can fax them to me - pm me for my fax number.

Thanks

These nightmare cases of customs is why I wait for the Allentown show for parts, or I ask sellers to ship using USPS, or forget it. I have also had my share of bullshit. I still haven't digested my leg leveller purchase from last year. A vendor was selling them dirt cheap, but after custom taxes and brokerage fees, they actually cost MORE than me buying them at Alouette's, of all places. It is why I don't deal with merchants like Marco's or Happ's unless I absolutely have to or as long as they agree to use USPS.

Quoted from Sparky

These nightmare cases of customs is why I wait for the Allentown show for parts, or I ask sellers to ship using USPS, or forget it.  

The other option is to ship to a UPS Store in a US Border town,

For Ottawa folks, there is a UPS Store in Ogdensburg NY,  ( just at the end of HWY 416 )
which is litterally 3 minutes from the Canada/US border.
( 60% of their business is Canadian customers ! )

They charge a $5 handling for any size package, and $3 for a letter-size.

I've had many many things shipped there including PF's, heavy eprom programmers ( Data I/0 29B ! ),
and stuff where the seller insisted on having courrier tracking.
(...you can even have Fedex Stuff shipped to the UPS Store ! )

I can then cross the border with the items on my own terms.

The whole drive there and back takes about 2 hrs  (....which I do about once a month ).
Even with the price of gas, the money I save on shipping costs and by clearing customs myself, is well worth it...

Unfortunately for Montreal folks, the closest UPS Store appears to be in Burlington VT,
which is 150KM away .  That makes a return trip about 3.5hrs, including crossing the Border.

... maybe Allentown isn't such a bad idea for you guys ... !  

Steph

ok..
9813000096 - Pinball Machine / Parts being returned to Canada, that started out being in Canada, no changes to them.  No GST, No PST, No Duty.

Warranty Repair  = GST Code 66, VFD Code 15 (Must have Proof of Export, and statement), TT10, Annex 9992  (Duty Free, GST Exempt, PST ?)

Warranty Replacement = GST Code 55, VFD Code 15 (DUTIABLE (if duty normally applies), GST Exempt, PST ?)