Hey all,

OK... I now have a Silverball Mania fully running except that 3 displays are degassing and burning out big-time. I just had the power supply rebuilt and prior to that, the high voltage section was toast (probably the displays didn't help...).

My dilemna is this... do I change the plasma glass on all of them, or just go for LED displays? The prices come up to about the same... this is what I gathered:

- original glasses are about 45$ each on average, and you have to remove the old ones and solder on the new ones... and you are still stuck with an original 30-year-old display board...

- PINLED kits are about the same price as a total plasma glass change without the hassle, BUT the LED boxes are grey thus show through the glass, and would need a bit of modifying as there is a gap between the digits where backbox lighting shines through, unlike the original framed Bally displays. They would possibly need a smoky acetate in front of them to dim the grey, but that would also dim the display even more...

- there seems to be other makers of LED displays as well. Marcospec sells Pinsore displays (they actually have adjustable brightness... nice too, but again, a gap on 6-digit displays...), Pinball Resource sells the Pioneer Microsystems displays (pricey!!!), Bay Area sells PINLED (but you can get these off Ebay as well).

Any advice?

I like the Pinscore LED displays as they are black, but I question the ability for a 5V circuit to handle them...

Gameroom Magazine did a review of the PinLED and PinScore displays and the nod was givin tot he PinScore displayes over the PinLed displays.  I could scan in the article if you wanted to read it.

I have Pinscore displays in my Space Station and they're awesome.

As for the power supply being able to handle the 5V... the displays already use 5V, so I'm not sure it would be much more of a draw than normal. I've seen lots of opinions on RGP regarding the bally/stern pinscore displays and the general consensus is that they rock and cause no problems. And if they did cause any problems, chances are the components that would fail would be near their breaking point anyway. If you have a healthy 5V circuit with fresh components and a new big cap, you should be fine.

If I had 3 displays out, I'd be looking at picking up a new set of pinscores rather than repairing the 3 bad displays. Either that or I'd just purchase three used displays and hope that they have good glass. Obviously new displays is less risky... but more expensive than buying used.

Quoted from cooke

If I had 3 displays out, I'd be looking at picking up a new set of pinscores rather than repairing the 3 bad displays. Either that or I'd just purchase three used displays and hope that they have good glass. Obviously new displays is less risky... but more expensive than buying used.

Well, considering that I am restoring a Silverball Mania, an Eight Ball and a Playboy, I might just gather all the displays together and test them all. If I have at least 10 good ones, then I will get 1 set. If over 5 but under 10, I will get 2 sets.

I am just truly tired of the whole "hunting for displays" thing. The glass is expensive and takes a lot of time to replace and most that I have done ended up with the "pads" on the boards coming right off, so I couldn't solder them on, therefore almost scrapping the new glass and having to look for a board.

Hey Adam, if you don't mind, yeah, can you scan the article?

The only downside then with Pinscore is Marcospec and their completely-insane UPS shipping. I would try to ask for USPS if they do it...

I was talking with them last week about shipping, and they were going to send me a 4lb box of parts Fedex overnight to Toronto for under $30.  Given what we pay here @ work for Fedex P1 shipments, that wasn't too unreasonable, and the best part is the brokerage is included with that service, so no UPS brokerage bill to worry about.  You'd still be on the hook for the tax though....

D.

Don't have a scanner at home and don't have the magazine with me so I'll scan it for you tommorow if that is alright.  

Marco will ship via USPS Global Priority Mail if you ask in the comment box at the the bottom of the order form. I use it everytime with them. FED EX or UPS is just insane at the residential level.

Dan

P.S. I have a box of extra working displays if you're stuck.

Quoted from Bally Boy

Marco will ship via USPS Global Priority Mail if you ask in the comment box at the the bottom of the order form. I use it everytime with them. FED EX or UPS is just insane at the residential level.

Dan

USPS recently changed up their offerings, now they have Global Express Guaranteed (1-2 days), Express Mail International (3-5 days), Priority Mail (6-10 days), First Class (no guarantee). (i.e. it's no longer called "Global Priority", but "Priority Mail International".

I just placed an order with Marco (new web site), and I believe that USPS Express Mail was the only choice, which is a shame because the price ($40+) seems more akin to Global Express or UPS Air which is the 1 - 2 day service (unless they've gotten the terminology mixed up).  Didn't seem cheaper than the previous UPS service (except no one will miss the $35 brokerage fee).  

Personally I like US suppliers to use Priority Mail, gives you a good mix of cost versus transit time, (particularly if they use a USPS flat rate box), and had I known, I would have asked.  Only beware their form comment box now only takes something like 10 or 15 letters, so not much room to write.  They had a "special" advertised, but their cart didn't give me the special.

Quoted from Sparky

OK... I now have a Silverball Mania fully running except that 3 displays are degassing and burning out big-time.
I just had the power supply rebuilt and prior to that, the high voltage section was toast (probably the displays didn't help...).

Just curious, at what high voltage level is your Solenoid Driver high voltage regulator currently adjusted to ?
The 'burning-up' of the three displays seems a bit peculiar to me...

Cheers,
- Sylvain.

Yeah like Sylvain said sounds a little fishy,
I had EK at Henries with that issue was a darlinton that was the problem.

Quoted from sylvain

Just curious, at what high voltage level is your Solenoid Driver high voltage regulator currently adjusted to ?
The 'burning-up' of the three displays seems a bit peculiar to me...

Cheers,
- Sylvain.

Power supply was just rebuilt. I believe it is around 195 now. Don't forget... these displays are just old and tired... they didn't burn up overnight.

I usually lower the high voltage on all my Bally machines of that era to 175 volts.

Cheers,
- Sylvain.

See for yourself...

Here is the article Ian:

http://abpythons.ca/GameRoomMag/

The pages are in 2 .pdf files, Black and White only, scanner doesn't do color.  

I think Clay's guide shows him adjusting the High Voltage ( on the Solenoid board ) down to 170V for the displays.

I've personally run these display at as low as 160V but some ( single displays ) seem take longer to warm up and get working at this voltage level. I'd say the 170V  is a safe bet.

Dan

There has been some discussion about this on RGP ... some people recommend a happy medium at 180-185v because lowering the voltage too much places more strain on the HV section and causes more heat dissipation in that area of the board.

That said, I usually lower to around 175 or so. Clay's guides have never steered me wrong before.

Make your own judgment call.