Quoted Text

Vid's are still going pretty strong though

I was under the impression the vid market is suffering, atleast thats the story all the local ops tell me. Something about games come out in arcades and then to console 3-6 months later.

What's selling well nowadays are those 'redemption games'...(AKA slot machines for kids)...

Quoted from takochef

1992 was bumper year because TAF was the first game in a long time to sell 20K units. whereas in the 70 & 80's many titles moved 15-20K unitss.
in 1993 TZ and ST:TNG move only 10-12K, the  drop starts and sadly gets worse with wpc95..  Combine that with management that doesn't give a f**K, p2k was lucky to even see the light of day...

Yup... basically, pinball was in decline way before P2K. Try early 80's.

Sales of even early WPCs pale in comparison to the SS era. TZ and TAF were mentioned. That's only 2. And even then, I have always believed that someone at Williams just wanted a more recent pin to beat the production of ... Eight Ball!!! By a mere 40 units if you don't count the useless TAF Gold Edition... and this, if you don't count the estimated 75000 (!!!) Ballyhoos produced in the 30's...

Here are some stagerring numbers... all pins produced over 10000 units... check out the years:

1975  Bally Wizard               10005 units
1976  Bally Capt.Fantastic     16155 units
         Bally Fireball (home)   10000 units
         Williams Space Mission 11652 units
         Williams Aztec             10150 units
         Williams Grand Prix     10554 units
1977  Bally Evel Knievel        14000 units
         Bally Eight Ball            20230 units
1978  Bally Power Play          13750 units
         Bally Mata Hari            16260 units
         Bally Strikes & Spares  12820 units
         Bally Lost World          10330 units
         Bally 6MDM                 10320 units
         Bally Playboy              18250 units
1979  Bally Star Trek            16842 units
         Bally Kiss                    17000 units
         Bally Harlem GlobeT.   14550 units
         Bally Supersonic          10340 units
         Williams Flash             19505 units
         Williams Gorgar           14000 units
1980  Bally Silverball Mania   10350 units
         Bally Space Invaders    11400 units
         Bally Xenon                 11000 units
         Williams Firepower        17410 units
         Williams Black Knight    13075 units
1981  Bally Flash Gordon        10000 units
1982  Bally Mr.&Mrs.PacMan   10600 units
1983... nothing
1984... nothing
1985... nope
... then, a little hope, but not for long...
1986  Williams High Speed     17080 units
         Williams Pinbot            12001 units
1987  Williams F14 Tomcat    14502 units
1988... zero
1989... crap-ola
1990  Williams FunHouse       10750 units
1991  Williams T2                 15202 units

then nothing worth mentioning up until 1992...
... the slight rebirth...

1992  Bally Addams Family     20270 units
         Williams Getaway         13259 units
         Williams Fish Tales       13640 units
1993  Bally Twilight Zone        15235 units
         Williams IJ                   12716 units
         Williams STTNG            11728 units


...Pull your own conclusions...

Quoted from Moonlit_Knight

Yup... basically, pinball was in decline way before P2K. Try early 80's.

I wonder what really caused it ... the decline that is.
-home computers? (internet, pc games, etc)
-home consol units, stealing the next generation of arcade frequenters? (NES, Sega, Atari, etc)
-increasing operating costs pushing people out of business.
-all of us growing up and starting careers, family ...i.e things that kept us out of the arcade.

in my neck of the woods.  i think it was due to the fact they closed down most of the arcade back in the day.   because they were to close to schools.  shoot when i went to high school there was a great arcade across the street.  kind of remeber the days of skipping and going behind it to smoke pot and then spend the day playing.  oh, i see why they closed them now.  no arcades in our city at all anymore and have to travel to next city for one.  was great when i lived in TO.  had lots to play and there is a place i think called MONSTER RECORDS that brought in different machines.  played spider man pin and joust vid there.  i have kids dropping by our tattoo shop just to play games.  well i say kids but mostly it the parents.  

Quoted from Meat_Popsicle

I wonder what really caused it ... the decline that is.
-home computers? (internet, pc games, etc)
-home consol units, stealing the next generation of arcade frequenters? (NES, Sega, Atari, etc)
-increasing operating costs pushing people out of business.
-all of us growing up and starting careers, family ...i.e things that kept us out of the arcade.

Easy.... look at the production list I put up... notice the decline in 1979? It is pretty much when vids started to go full swing. An operator had a choice between a pin, which had maintenance costs and an average game lasted 5 minutes, or a vid, practically zero maintenance and the average quarter lasted 2 minutes. No-brainer...

The slight renaissance in the mid-80's is probably a combination of great titles, vids dying off due to great consoles (the NES), and people still having the urge to pop quarters into a machine.

Great technology advances and cool gadgetry brought them back in the early 90's, but that wore off quick. The average age of people at arcades these days is probably 14-16... well, around here anyways. They prefer simulators (driving, dancing, drumming, etc...).

But I have a good feeling we will probably see another renaissance soon, but it depends on a few factors:

- Stern must pump out a few more great titles, and improve overall quality
- We need to see another SERIOUS manufacturer (sorry Gillard... we have yet to see a Crack Hunter)
- Tendency of consumers getting tired of the same-ole driving games must persist.

At this stage, I can almost see a better chance of Gottlieb rising out of the ashes than Williams or Bally... Very sad...

Seems irresponsible not to sell off the pin division after P2K introduced.

People don't get out and do squat anymore. They sit at home and wait for the next movie to come out on DVD or next game for their console or PC. Too much mental stimulation without having to make an effort to go out and get it.